The ISIS ‘caliphate’ has been dismantled, but the conditions that led to its rise and the extremists attracted to it remain, according to Shatter the Nations: ISIS and the War for the Caliphate author Mike Giglio. Few journalists got as close to the conflict on both sides as Mike, who spent six years as a foreign correspondent covering the ISIS proto-state. Reflecting on his dealings with everyone from US soldiers to ISIS defectors, Mike talks with ABC’s Matt Brown about his “hypnotically compelling” (New Yorker staff writer Jon Lee Anderson) account of the rise and fall of ISIS, and the human stories of those affected.

Mike Giglio (International)

Mike Giglio

Mike Giglio is a staff writer at The Atlantic in Washington, DC. He was previously based in Istanbul and reported extensively from the wars and conflicts that defined the last decade. His first book, Shatter the Nations: ISIS and the War for the Caliphate, is based on five years of immersive reporting from Iraq, Syria and southern Turkey, and includes voices from all sides of the conflict. He is a two-time finalist for the Livingston Award for Young Journalists and a winner of the Arthur F. Burns Prize.

Matt Brown (Australian)

Matt Brown

Matt Brown is the Deputy International Editor for the Australian Broadcasting Corporation, managing major coverage and assignments with correspondents in 10 international bureaux. He was a foreign correspondent for nearly 13 years, serving in Jakarta, Beirut and Jerusalem, covering wars in the Gaza Strip, Lebanon, Iraq, Syria, Georgia and Ukraine. He is the winner of the Lowy Institute Media Award, five Walkley Awards, three UN Media Peace Awards and a New York Festivals Gold World Medal.